Sustaining nature

[00:00:21] Barrington Walker: I am Barrington Walker, Vice Provost for equity and professor of history at McMaster University advice chair of the order of directors of the Federation for the humanities and social sciences. 

[00:00:37] On behalf of the Federation and McGill University, I'm delighted to welcome you to the third Big Thinking event at the 93rd Congress of the humanities and social sciences, sustaining nature.  

[00:00:49] Today, Ingrid Waldron, Sébastien Jodoin, and Angele Alook will draw on their work on environmental justice and climate action research to discuss the intersection of environmental racism, disability rights, and climate change among Indigenous, Black, and racialized communities, as well as those living with disability and illness. They will be joined in the discussion by moderator Jaela Berstein.

[00:01:18] Today's event will take place in English, French, American sign language, and come Québec sign language. Closed captioning will be in English and French. Interpreters will be on the screen, onstage, and on the Zoom screen for those joining virtually. To access simultaneous interpretation, scan the QR code posted on the doors when you enter the room. For those joining virtually, click on the closed captioning button to enable captions. To use simultaneous interpretation, click on the interpretation button and select the language you would like to listen to.  

[00:02:04] If you are joining us virtually, we recognize the following land acknowledgment might not be for the territory you are currently on. We ask that if this is the case you take the responsibility to acknowledge the traditional territory you are on and the current treaty holders.  

[00:02:21] We begin by acknowledging that McGill University where we are gathered today is on land that long served as a site of meeting and exchange among Indigenous peoples. We recognize and thank the diverse Indigenous peoples whose presence marks the territory in which we now gather.  

[00:02:44] So, it is now my pleasure to introduce the Big Thinking series, which brings together scholars and public figures to address the most pressing questions of our time. For Congress 2024, it amplifies the theme of sustaining shared futures with conversations that reflect on what remains collectively attainable and what must be done to bring forth solutions for today with sustained systems of tomorrow.  

[00:03:13] On behalf of the Federation at McGill University, I thank the series leading sponsors, the Canada Foundation for Innovation and Universities Canada, and the presenting partner, the Social Sciences Research Council.  

[00:03:27] Thank you also much for joining us today and please join me in welcoming Sylvie Lamoureaux vice president of research at the Social Sciences and Humanities Council, who will introduce today's conversation.

[00:03:47] Sylvie Lamoureaux: Merci, Barrington. Good morning to everyone. I'm really happy to be here today. As Barrington mentioned, I’m the vice president at the Social Sciences and Humanities Council. It is my great honor to introduce today's Big Thinking panel session.  

[00:04:14] Let me begin with a fact that we all know. The global climate crisis requires immediate action. Sustaining nature is the imperative of our time. As humans, we have not only the ability, but the imperative to positively shape our interactions with each other and the natural world.  

[00:04:36] We have the responsibility to take on this immense challenge with urgency, insight, purpose, and moral clarity. In this regard, I am so proud to highlight Canadian leadership on the international joint initiative for research and climate change adaptation and mitigation for which the Government of Canada recently announced $60 million to support 32 interdisciplinary projects supported through the new frontiers and research fund, a tri-agency program administered by SSHRC.  

[00:03:47] It involves 424 researchers from 45 countries focused on designing and implementing adaptation mitigation strategies for vulnerable groups around the world. I will now switch to French. The answer we provide to climate change must take into account the impact on the communities, collective and individual action.  

[00:05:36] We can only reach this if we understand the crossroad between environmental racism, the rights of people living with a handicap, and inequalities linked to climate change among the Indigenous communities, Black communities, and marginalized groups.  

[00:05:59] It's my pleasure to introduce our thought-provoking panel, who will help us envision alternative sustainable futures rooted in environmental justice, disability inclusive approaches, and Indigenous climate leadership. Let me welcome Angele Alook, assistant professor in the school of gender, sexuality and women's studies at York University.  

[00:06:23] She is a proud member of Big Stone nation in treaty eight territory, where she has carried out research projects on topics like family and work, resource extraction, and Indigenous identity. Her most recent research focuses on a just transition away from fossil fuels, Indigenous caring economies, and Indigenous climate justice. She is the co-author of the national best-selling book, "The end of this world, climate justice in the so-called Canada."  

[00:06:57] Switching to French, our second panelist, Sébastien Jodoin, is the director of the disability inclusive climate action research program. This program gathers academics and activists around the world in order to generate, translate, and produce knowledge of how efforts to fight against climate change can be designed and implemented while respecting the rights of the people who live with a handicapped disability. The action within the program is saluted by the United Nations and groups around the world. Thank you and welcome.  

[00:07:43] Welcome Ingrid Waldron, professor and Hope chair in Peace and Health in the Social Peace and Justice program at McMaster University. Her research focuses on environmental and climate injustice in Black, Indigenous and other racialized communities as well as the health impacts.  

[00:08:07] She is the author of the book and co-producer, along with renowned actor and activist Elliot page, of the Netflix documentary, "There is something in the water, environmental racism in Indigenous and Black communities."  

[00:08:23] Ingrid has also helped to develop the federal private members bill, a national strategy respecting environmental justice and racism, which was approved last Thursday to become Canada's first environmental justice law. This is a historic moment. Congratulations to everyone involved and this huge milestone for environmental justice and the world.  

[00:08:49] Switching to French, Jaela Berstein will be our moderator today. Jaela is a bilingual journalist who covers climate change and the environment for online radio and other programs on the CDC, she has more than 10 years of experience and has received many awards for her work. Jaela, we look forward to the discussion. Over to you, Jaela.  

[00:09:42] Jaela Berstein: Welcome, our panelists. Hi, everyone. We will let everyone get seated and comfy, here. I am just thrilled to be here with this really impressive lineup of folks. We heard all of their accomplishments already and I'm so excited for the discussion we are going to have today. As a climate journalist especially I'm extra pumped to be talking to them today and we are here to talk sustaining nature and the intersections of climate change, disability rights, environmental racism and just transition and I know that this is going to be a really good discussion, they all have a lot of interesting things to say.  

[00:10:14] We got talking behind the curtain, we couldn't stop ourselves. I'm excited to hear all of you way in with thoughtful insight. I'm going to stop talking out and hand things over. We are going to have everybody do opening remarks and then launch into a bit of a Q&A discussion amongst ourselves. Without further ado, Ingrid, I think you would like to be the first of the podium.  

[00:10:42] Ingrid Waldron: So, good morning, everyone. As was mentioned earlier, I'm a professor and the Hope chair in Peace and Health at the global peace and social justice program at the faculty of humanities at McMaster University. Before that I was at Dalhousie at the faculty of health where I began my work on environmental racism in 2012.  

[00:11:07] I'm also the founder and Executive Director of the Enriched project, the environmental noxiousness, racial inequities and community health project. The cofounder and codirector of the Canadian Coalition for Climate and Environmental Justice. And the past Vice President of Rural Water Watch, a water testing and NGO in Nova Scotia.  

[00:11:36] Since 2012, I have been conducting research engaging with policy interventions and leading organizational initiatives to address environmental racism and climate change inequities in racialized and other vulnerable communities.  

[00:11:56] When I began the work, people often ask what environmental racism was. They had never heard of the term. Got a lot of quizzical looks from journalists and community members. There's a fantastic definition of environmental racism that comes from Dr. Robert Bullard, an African-American who coined the term in the early 1990's.  

[00:12:22] So, environmental racism can be defined as: racial discrimination in the disproportionate sighting of toxic facilities in primarily Indigenous, Black, in the case of United States, Hispanic and other racialized communities. It's also about the lack of political power these communities have for fighting against environmental racism.  

[00:12:59] I always want to say that these communities have a certain personal power, they do rise up and are involved in movements, but because they are simultaneously low income and living in isolated, rural areas, because they are racialized, they are often not heard by governments, so lack of political power, lack of social economic power contributes to the difficulties they have experienced challenging this issue.  

[00:13:16] Environmental racism is also about policy, so when we see the spatial patterning of industry in these communities across Canada, it has everything to do with environmental policies and the policies and decision-making that, that is directed by policymakers who typically do not look like the communities impacted. So, it's about the implementation of those policies and the implementation of environmental assessments leading to the outcome that we see.  

[00:13:48] Environmental racism is also in the disproportionate negative district of those environmental policies that result in the delays in cleanup. That is when you have to ask, for example, if you are landing in a first nation in Nova Scotia, why did it take over 50 years for that community to have their issues addressed. In 1967 a mill started pumping effluent into bolt harbor. In 2020, the government announced that the mill would stop operating. It has taken a long time for them to see redress.  

[00:14:26] Finally, the other definition of environmental racism is in the history of excluding the very communities that have been impacted by environmental racism. We often talk about certain communities not having a seat at the table. This is precisely what I'm talking about. We rarely see the impacted communities at the table involved in decision-making, involved in policymaking. Those of the five definition isn't of environmental racism.  

[00:14:57] Next I want to talk about just a few cases of communities that have been impacted by environmental racism across Canada over the last few years. Starting with Nova Scotia.  

[00:15:12] First, the Sipekne’katik First Nation starting in 2014 had to deal with a brine discharge pipeline being planned in their community. Fortunately, that project was halted in 2021.  

[00:15:32] I just mentioned the Pictou Landing First Nation. Starting in 1967 a mill started pumping wastewater into the Boat Harbour there. In 2019, the government announced that they needed to stop making broken promises to the community. They were making broken promises since the 1980's, promising the community that there would be cleanup and it never happened. So, they announced late in 2019 that they would close the mill. In 2020 at the end of January, the mill was closed.  

[00:16:12] Then we have Aamjiwnaang First Nation near Sarnia Ontario, is often referred to as Chemical Valley. To me this is the worst case scenario of environmental racism, they have over 60 petrochemical facilities surrounding the Indigenous community.  

[00:16:36] You may have heard of Grassy Narrows First Nation. In the 1960-70’s mercury was dumped into the river. Although there was a multimillion dollar cleanup, the health effects remain. People often talk about the cleanup but I say there are health effect remaining in the community. In a 2022 CBC article many residents came out to talk about some of those health impacts, including neurological issues, cognitive delays, numbness in fingers, etc.  

[00:17:17] There is also Wet'Suatan First Nation in northern BC. There's a multibillion dollar pipeline plan for that community. Over the past several years there has been a lot of action amongst Canadians to stop or halt that project, with sit ins, marches, etc.  

[00:17:43] One of the things I have noticed doing this work is that people often don't associate environmental racism with Black communities. During my time in Nova Scotia, I found that there particularly there are a lot of cases of environmental racism in the African Nova Scotia and community.  

[00:18:00] Lets start with Africville. Africville was subjected to both gentrification and environmental racism. I think those are intersecting issues. The government was planning to push out the African Nova Scotia community, to make way for industrial development. In the wake of industrial development, a lot of social and industrial hazards were left in the community, including an open dump, three systems of railway tracks, a cotton factory, tar factory, etc.  

[00:18:38] There's also Lincolnville, another African Nova Scotian community. Starting in 1974, a first generation landfill was placed in the community. Then in 2006, when I think the community felt the first generation landfill was going to be relocated, the government put a second-generation landfill on top of the first one. Like many of the communities I work with, they believe that higher rates of cancer and increasing rates of cancer over the years are due to both landfills.  

[00:19:10] And then we have Shelburne. The south of Shelburne is an African Nova Scotia community. The North is a white community, primarily. In the South there has been a dump in their community since 1943.  

[00:19:31] I want to talk about the intersection of environmental racism and climate change. I feel that people often use those terms interchangeably, climate change and environmental racism, they are different issues but connected. I want to talk about that for a bit.  

[00:19:48] Climate justice is then a concept and a movement that recognizes that different will be impacted differently and unequally by climate change based on a number of factors. These factors include race, socioeconomic status, social class, gender, age, disability, sexuality, geographic location, and other social identities and factors.  

[00:20:21] The climate justice framework highlights the fact that Indigenous, Black, and other racialized and marginalized communities in the global North and South are disproportionately vulnerable to the climate crisis, because they are more likely to be exposed to pollution and contamination from nearby industries. When we talk about pollution and contamination, that's environmental racism.  

[00:20:44] Environmental racism with pollution and contamination gives rise to climate change because when we talk about greenhouse gas emissions, for example, it is pollution that contributes to that. So that is how they are technically or chemically connected.  

[00:21:00] It is also about where these communities live, residing in places where they are more likely to be impacted by rising sea levels, disappearing shorelines, frequent and heavy rain falls, raging storms, floods, intense heat waves, increasing wildfire, poor air quality, higher rates of climate related diseases, and other effects of climate change.  

[00:21:25] In addition, Indigenous, Black, and other racialized communities are at a greater risk for climate disasters because they are more likely to experience long-standing structural inequity. In order to understand why environmental racism and climate change happens, we have to look at colonization, racism in the structural inequities these communities are dealing with because of colonization. Underlying structural inequities like low income, poverty, racism give rise to environmental racism and climate change. They don't happen in isolation. They happen or emerge out of existing structural inequities.  

[00:22:12] The link between climate inequities and environmental racism among Indigenous and Black communities specifically is clear. When we consider the role that geography plays in both of these crises.  

[00:22:30] Indigenous communities for example, they are on reserves. In the northern regions of Canada, African Nova Scotian communities are disproportionately in rural isolated places of Nova Scotia, a province mostly surrounded by the sea. These are communities disproportionately impacted, as I said earlier, by climate disaster resulting from rising sea levels, Cetera So, we have to look at where people live. Geography is a factor. With Black communities in Nova Scotia, residing in isolated rural places, it actually contributes to their exposure to climate change.  

[00:23:16] When we trace the climate crisis affect the slavery and colonialism, it's clear that climate change arose out of a legacy of extraction that disproportionately impacted Black and Indigenous people and consequently is inextricably linked to a legacy of environmental racism in these communities.  

[00:23:43] Given these intersections, the fights against climate justice, change, environmental racism and racial injustice, are considerably intertwined and must be addressed together.  

[00:23:58] So, I just want to talk briefly about some of the things my organization, The Enrich Project, has been doing to address both of these issues. Since the fall of 2012 I have been engaged in multidisciplinary, multimedia, interdisciplinary community-based work to address both of these issues.  

[00:24:23] These projects I have been involved in include raising awareness. As I said earlier, a lot of the people I met just didn't understand the term environmental racism and I realize I had to do a lot of work around raising awareness around environmental racism and climate injustices in Canada.  

[00:24:40] I did that through workshops, symposiums, talks, and other public events. I also conducted interdisciplinary community-based research led by the communities that have been impacted by these crises. I've shared research in multiple ways. It's part of the educational awareness we needed to do and I have used multimedia so that people can receive information in different ways, people learn in different ways. I like to be creative and for me multimedia is a way to be creative.  

[00:25:19] I’ve done mapping. Mapping cases of environmental racism across Canada using a map that uses GIS analysis. If you go to my website, you will see the location of Indigenous, Black communities and the waste sites that are near to those communities. I coproduced a documentary streamed on Netflix with Canadian actor Elliott page. That's also on prime video and Microsoft Xbox.  

[00:25:55] The Africville story map was created for my project. You can run about Africville through maps, audio and video. It's a one-stop shop media source for that story and I have of course given a lot of interviews to media, posted information on social media as well.  

[00:26:17] There is also a book I wrote on environmental racism and I found it important to build capacities in the communities, not just take and never return but develop their skills. For example in water testing. I mentioned the rural water watch, the organization I cofounded, we test water in the communities and we teach them to test their own water.  

[00:26:42] Finally, helping to develop the first environmental racism federal bill as was mentioned earlier. That has been a journey since 2015, trying to get a provincial environmental justice bill passed. Thursday of last week, the federal bill that I codeveloped with Lenorzan that Elizabeth May introduced finally passed the third reading and becomes Canada's first environmental justice law.  

[00:27:12] Along with that there will be a environmental justice national strategy where we do consultations across Canada with impacted communities and I have been asked to consult on that environmental justice strategy.  

[00:27:26] Also, in Ottawa an environmental racism symposium will be held in the fall at the library archives that I will be helping to organize. So, there are a lot of things happening right now around environmental racism and I'm very pleased to be at the center of it. Thank you very much.

[00:27:52] Jaela Berstein: Thank you so much, Ingrid. That was fascinating it is not lost on me that we are on the cusp of a heat wave here in Montreal. I think it has already hit Ontario and we have all been thinking about how people are affected differently and in rural areas by the heat. And we had the evacuations in the Northwest for the wildfires. Definitely some food for thought there in what you were saying. Next we have Angele, ready at the podium, to talk to us about just transitions and solutions as well.  

[00:28:26] Angele Alook: OK, thank you. My name is Angele Alook, from treaty A territory. I'm a gender studies professor and labor expert and have been acting in the UNFCCC, which I will discuss.  

[00:28:41] Today I want to talk about Indigenous climate futures and restoring Indigenous economies of care and Indigenous climate leadership. So, my research asks these questions. How can we address the climate crisis using Indigenous knowledge systems, restoring Indigenous sovereignty, uplifting the voices of Indigenous climate leaders? How can we transition our economy away from fossil fuels? How could we transition to the better future for all. What are the Indigenous solutions to the climate crisis?  

[00:29:23] Today I will be talking mostly about Indigenous climate solutions and using the voices and words of the Indigenous folks I have interviewed. In order to the question, I would like to redefine what a just transition is. So, a true just transition for Indigenous people should imagine a future built on Indigenous knowledges with transformational shifts in how we think about work and economies. A just transition should be for all, should be led by Indigenous understandings of economies, livelihood, and life.  

[00:30:04] So, I'm just going to do a quick activity. I did this when I was in Dubai at the Canadian Pavilion. I want everyone to just close your eyes and imagine a time when you felt cared for. When someone served you food. When someone gave you a hug. When you felt like you belonged.  

[00:30:33] For me, that is going home to my community. That is eating moose meat. That is picking berries with my aunties. That's going to the garden with my children. It is speaking my language, which I love, and it is being on the land. And it is about the matriarchy, women leading our future. So, imagine, open your eyes, imagine a world where we actually built our economies based on caring for each other. Not on a death economy.  

[00:31:10] I am going to read from my book, The end of this World, "a capitalist colonial economy has caused Indigenous societies to go from economic systems of sharing, caring, respect, and reciprocity with the land, where responsibility to the collective provided well-being from cradle to gave, to a colonial system that displaced Indigenous peoples from their lands and pushed them into economies of poverty and dependency, with only enough funding to keep them alive. Working to restore miyo-pimatisiwin – which means to live a good life in Cree – will destroy a capitalist colonial economy that is based on the ‘death drive’ of Indigenous peoples and restore ethical economies adapted to our present realities."  

[00:32:00] At this time we think of this new future, the new economy must be built on life. The laws of raising your children and a good way, good relations and unity, pulling together for survival, and one of the most important laws in my culture, respect and reciprocity. You should only take from the land what you need. All of these lead to what I refer to as [Speaking Another Language] in my research, which means to live a good life with balanced family at work.  

[00:32:45] Together, these laws provide a strong basis for climate safe care centered equitable worlds that we want to build going forward. So, I would like us to just imagine a different future. What helps me imagine this new future is doing research on this project that is called Indigenous climate leadership and self-determined futures.  

[00:33:12] So, in this project, this project applies Indigenous research approaches to understand and support Indigenous climate leadership and governance through a feminist and decolonial lens.  

[00:33:27] We spoke to Indigenous climate leaders at cop 27, cop 28. We also held intergenerational dialogues in Toronto and spoke to Indigenous folks from all over turtle Island, parts of Central and South America, and we have recently interviewed Indigenous folks from parts of East Africa as well.  

[00:33:51] If you do not know what UNFCC C is, it's the United Nations framework convention on climate change. We did interviews at cop 27 and we look at what motivates Indigenous climate leaders, what challenges exist, what is Indigenous self-determination and what recommendations do community members make to value and support further Indigenous climate that action?  

[00:34:28] So, Indigenous people are motivated to be a part of the international dialogue out of necessity. Despite the significant challenge of the colonial practice of cop, the conference undoubtedly matters because the settler world has ascribed its importance. One way or another, decisions about all of our collective futures, as well as the futures of many other creatures, will be made in that space.  

[00:34:56] Through community members we heard that Indigenous leaders come to COP, out of love for their people in ways of being, and Indigenous leaders must be included and elevated in order to protect our lands and ways of life.  

[00:35:11] This is a quote from Janine Yazi, who says "we are at a tipping point when it comes to climate change impact, we are having to think about and create greater safe-guards for our rights as Indigenous peoples."  

[00:35:29] In the COP space, Indigenous folks are fighting colonialism. Indigenous folks experience colonialism there at the UNCCC and at COP, so when considering these challenges, we heard that COP basically asserts colonialism, through which nations are formally recognized and whose voices are valued and that is who gets to make decisions.  

[00:32:00] The colonial nature of this space creates a tension for Indigenous climate leaders who are fighting not only for climate solutions, but the sovereignty and rights to institute sustainable knowledge and practice.  

[00:36:12] This is a quote from JC Chibleau, "it's a fight everyday to make sure Indigenous rights at human rights are at the top priority of everything and there are actually a lot of states pushing back on that."  

[00:36:36] Another thing that we have noticed is discussions about the importance of frontline action. Things like food sovereignty. Here we have sunshine Dustin Moore talking about the mushroom project in her community in B.C. We've heard other Indigenous folks talking about controlled burns, alternative energy sources, activism through art and social media, and various other types of frontline action back home. But this is the next slide.  

[00:37:12] OK, so an important thing that we also know that is a part of Indigenous climate leadership is centering women and two-centre folks. Community members shared stories of women and two-spirit leadership when it came to discussing Indigenous climate leadership, traditional Indigenous knowledges promotes equal respect and inclusion on the spectrum of gender work in the community. Colonialism had been eroded Indigenous ways of being over time resulting in wide separate systems of patriarchy. Community members share that true Indigenous climate leadership requires intentional elevation of women and two-spirit climate action.  

[00:37:52] Here we hear from Dane Desousa from the Metis National Council, who says that, "we have learned from our first Nations ancestors the concept of being too spirited, celebrating those in your community who are different, enabling them to navigate different spaces and conversations."  

[00:38:12] We heard from Kennedy, who talked about the power of female leadership in these spaces. Many of these climate leaders are women. I think I am over my time. I just wanted to also talk about centering climate justice as a recommendation from these discussions that we had at COP 27.  

[00:38:12] Colonialism causes climate change and colonialism is still alive and well and the machine is still working against us. Even after first contact, hundreds of years after first contact, we are still fighting for our very lives and existence. It is just now in the water that we have to protect it. It's in the food systems we are trying to protect. It's in the lands and, you know, trying to make sure we are protecting the animals in the land in the water. That's Jacob Crane.  

[00:39:13] I am just going to close off, now. When I interview people in my home community and within these COP spaces, I often end the interview by asking people -- what are your hopes for the future? I get two common responses. Indigenous folks hope for Indigenous sovereignty. They hope for their future generations. This is a quote from my cousin, and environmental officer in my home community. When I asked her this question, she said -- I feel we are connected to the land as first Nations peoples. We are protectors who were given the duty to protect the land as first Nations peoples and I want my child to be able to see all the trees and have fresh water -- I'm sorry -- and I like my child, want to protect were treaty rights to do hunting, trapping, gathering of medicine and berries, just having a respect for the land, living off the land. I'm sorry, but this means a lot to me. This is my community, this is our land. So, thank you. Thank you.  

[00:40:39] Jaela Berstein: Thank you for sharing that. I know that's a really vulnerable thing to share testimony on. Thank you for sharing something so personal for you with the rest of us in being vulnerable and that. I really appreciate it. Something you said that really stood out to me was the responsibility to the collective that provided well-being cradle to grave. That's something I'm going to think about climate journalism and that's the poignant point that you made, so thank you. Sébastien?

[00:41:08] Sébastien Jodoin: Thank you. I want to start by thanking my union for allowing me to participate in this event. We have been on strike since April 24. Because of the subject matter of this panel aligning with our equity objectives of the Union of McGill law professors, they allowed me, so I'm grateful to them for that.  

[00:41:31] So, let me -- I'm going to make four points about the intersections around disability and climate change, but before I begin I would like to share something with you, which is that my first year of my tenure-track position here, I was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis.  

[00:41:38] That is the experience that led me to begin working on the intersections of climate change and disability. Specifically I discovered in the summer I was very sensitive to heat. Before they had MRI machines they would diagnose the people with a MS by putting them in hot baths. That was one thing I realized.  

[00:42:08] Also, in the early years of my journey, I guess, with MS, I had some mobility challenges and I found myself suddenly having to drive to work, having to use the disability parking at McGill , and suddenly was thinking --well, maybe, the people who drive are not just all evil people who don't think about climate change in the environment. Maybe they have health reasons or other structural reasons that make it impossible or unlikely for them to use other modes of transportation.  

[00:42:43] So, that's an epiphany, if you will, led me to think about the importance of accessibility and even empathy in how we approach both efforts to ensure that we are resilient to climate change and that also efforts transition into a low carbon world that are also accessible.  

[00:43:04] I like to point this out, also, because if you have never thought about the connection between disability and climate change, I don't want you to feel bad about it. I had never thought of it either and I was a climate expert until I was diagnosed with MS.  

[00:43:20] If you work for government and you’ve never thought about the connection between climate change and disability, I would like you to feel bad about that because there are laws that obliged you to take into account, and Canada has signed treaties to that effect. There is now more and more research that myself and other colleagues have been able to put out into the world, so I am hoping you will reconsider and think about how to do better.

[00:43:46] So, the four things I want to say. First, people with disabilities are disproportionately affected by climate change. I will give you one data point about this. In the Pacific heat dome that struck the Northwest in July and June of 2021, so over 6000 people died, 92% had a disability. So, if your analysis of what happened during the heat dome focused on other factors of disability, you are missing a huge part of the puzzle.  

[00:44:22] The second point I want to make about the disproportionate impact of climate change on people with disabilities is that they are not natural. They are not something that is sort of just happening. It's the result of decisions that have placed people into positions of vulnerability.  

[00:44:39] To illustrate this, I will refer to a heat wave that struck Montreal in July of 2018. 60 people died in this heat wave. One quarter of those who died had schizophrenia. That's a death rate that is 500 times their share of the Québec population.  

[00:45:00] You might wonder why -- what would schizophrenia have to do with being more likely to die in a heat wave? When you look at answering the question, you can see how different factors play a role in generating vulnerability.

[00:45:12] In terms of exposure, the people who died lived in neighborhood that were economically disadvantaged, with fewer green spaces, and lived in buildings without air conditioning or passive cooling. They are just more exposed to the impacts of a heat wave.  

[00:45:30] In terms of sensitivity, if you have schizophrenia you may elect to take certain medications that might make you very intolerant to heat. There is that individual susceptibility. The main reason we can point out to explain the disproportional death rate is what's called adaptive capacity. So, what assets, what services, knowledge, and support people have access to that allows them to cope with, and be resilient, and to adapt to this changing climate.  

[00:46:08] The first thing you should know, is that the authorities responding to this heat wave did not have this community in mind. If you look at the heat wave response plans for prior to this heat wave, they referenced older people in children. They didn't have this community in mind.  

[00:46:20] There was nothing in the adaptation planning of the city of Montreal then or today that actually looks at how disability might make you more sensitive or expose you to greater climate risks. So, ultimately in a longer-term barrier, right, so if, if people -- it's not everyone who lives with schizophrenia who dies in a heat wave. But because this condition is stigmatized you don't necessarily have friends and family checking in on you or the income to live in an air-conditioned building or a neighborhood that has green spaces.  

[00:46:59] So, ultimately what you need to look at is short-term, medium-term, and long-term barriers to climate adaptation in terms of ensuring the resilience of people with disabilities.  

[00:47:11] The third point I want to make is that people with disabilities are also affected adversely by measures designed to reduce carbon emissions. This is one of the first empirical studies we have done here in Montreal. We have interviewed around 25 people with disabilities with a diversity of lived experiences and impairments about how they are affected by the really significant and the changes the city is making to transportation.  

[00:47:43] Montreal has a very ambitious  plan to de-carbonize, it is the largest source of carbon emissions in the city. By interviewing this diverse community we are able to see the barriers that are being addressed, or what we found is that what most of these are doing is reducing barriers to mobility.  

[00:48:07] I will share just one example of that. We have all of these bike lanes in Montreal that have been developed, which I love, I'm a cyclist and I love these bike lanes, but have been designed in a way that makes it inaccessible for a wheelchair user, making it inaccessible to someone on the sidewalk in a wheelchair.  

[00:48:26] Doesn't have to be this way, San Francisco has accessible design, but we don’t have that in Montreal. In an interview, we were told about someone who had to leave school because they couldn't get into the building because of these bike lanes. This illustrates at a micro level about how they can reinforce barriers.  

[00:48:52] More broadly, or thinking on how to produce carbon emissions is we are thinking that all we have to do is tinker with incentives and information and people will change their behaviors. But we are failing to take into account the reasons why someone might be more dependent on one form over another, and how available are the alternatives to, lets say, motorized transportation.  

[00:49:17] In the city of Montreal, you should know that the vast majority of the subway system is it accessible to people with mobility impairments. If the idea is that it's more expensive to drive a car, people will take the metro, that only makes sense if the Metro is accessible.  

[00:49:38] What our research shows is that people with disabilities are being systematically neglected in climate adaptation and mitigation policies, but actually there is so much potential to including with disabilities in climate action, it would not only ensure that those actions are accessible to and inclusive of people with disabilities, but they do end up increasing the wider share of people who can benefit from and contribute to a transition to a low carbon work carbon resilient world. I have lots of examples if we have time during discussion. So, thank you very much.

[00:50:20] Jaela Berstein: Thank you. As I listen to the three of you speak, you all have your distinct areas of study and knowledge, and yet really are all talking about today is people who are disproportionately affected by climate change or environmental issues, or climate action and climate mitigation, and I think that is where all of you have said similar things but in different ways.  

[00:50:51] I'm excited to continue the conversation. Wanted to ask, how are we doing on time for discussion? OK, OK, going to throw some questions at each of you and we will see if we have any time left over after that.  

[00:51:03] Ingrid, starting with you. I don't know if everyone heard, but to emphasize it again, you have codeveloped a bill that has passed the third reading vote at the Senate. I don't know if anyone here has ever developed a bill before, but it's a pretty big deal. [LAUGHTER] I think it deserves acknowledgment again. Canada’s first environmental justice strategy. I know you’ve been working I would on this and many things for over a decade now in this line of work and I know it hasn’t always been easy. I would love it if you could share some examples of bumps in the road, hurdles and challenges, and give advice on how to overcome them. If you can do that's a sickly. [LAUGHTER]  

[00:51:56] Ingrid Waldron: This is not a topic that I chased. It's ironic that this has become my work because my doctoral and postdoctoral work looked at black women experiences with mental illness and help seeking. I thought I would continue doing that and then 2021, an environmental activist came to my office and said I want you to do a project on environmental racism.  

[00:52:15] He was leaving to go to Oakland California to do a startup. I said, "environmental racism, what's that? I’ve never heard of it." I was hesitant to take it on because I had never worked in that area and it scared me. But I realized it was a health issue and I was excited to work with Black and Indigenous communities. So I said yes, very hesitantly.  

[00:52:44] The first challenge was people not believing in what I was doing, being skeptical about the term and the reality of environmental racism of journalists, who looked at me and said -- you sure this is a real thing? Community members emailed me. I never got any disrespectful emails. I have colleagues that have gotten some-- I've never gotten one in my career that was disrespectful, but people just saying environmental racism, really?  

[00:53:16] Jaela Berstein: Not believing you?  

[00:53:18] Ingrid Waldron: Not believing the reality. They said, "are you sure it’s about race, it seems to be more about class." Someone sent me and mail saying and I said, "why can it not be about race and class?" There's an intersection framework and we had to look at that. The intersections of race, gender, class, and disability. That's the framework I use. I said cannot be about both?  

[00:53:18] The communities that were racialized that I was dealing with were also geographically isolated and low income. There are all of these intersections. That was the first challenge.

[00:53:46] The other challenge was, I was teaching in the health professions. I'm not a health profession, but my career as a sociologist, I’m a health sociologist, has been teaching in disciplines that are not my own.  

[00:54:02] And getting my students in nursing and occupational therapy to validate this and to see environmental determinants of health and other social determinants of health is something they should care about, was really tough.  

[00:54:15] To the point where, you know, I had antagonistic students in my classroom and I said to myself, "Ingrid, is the profession of being a professor for you?" I started questioning my work because they didn't want to know. They didn't want to know about environmental issues.  

[00:54:34] I understand that for a nurse, getting the technical skills is most important, of course. If you go to the head nurse, you want to know if they can put a needle in, you don't want to know if they'll about environmental racism, but it is important that they understand these concepts they are going to be dealing with a variety people who are diverse.  

[00:54:55] The teaching was really difficult in terms of students questioning by I was hired, why am I teaching them sociology, why do they need to know about environmental issues. It’s crucial with environmental crisis, you want a nurse there.  

[00:55:13] So, there have been challenges. Times where I didn't doubt myself but I wondered if I was in the right profession or if I was wasting my time. But I just kept going because the topic just intrigued me. It felt like a puzzle I needed to solve. It still does. I feel there is something that's missing that I need to solve. And until I solve it, I'm not going to stop.  

[00:55:38] Jaela Berstein: Clearly, you persevered. [LAUGHTER] So, good for you. I think the proof is in the pudding. We have seen you persevere and not give up. Congratulations to you for that.  

[00:55:51] That blends nicely into Angele, because your work is similar in some ways, and yet different. I was refreshing my mind on your book over the weekend preparing for this. There's a moment in your book where you talk about the wildfires in Fort McMurray. You are talking about when -- you're talking about families having to flee and evacuate and folks pitching in as a community and coming together.  

[00:56:22] You wrote "when a fire or flood comes, it doesn't matter if you are on reserve, in the city, or on a farm," and I thought what an interesting kind of metaphor to talk about the different -- I guess silos -- in our society. I would love for you to expand on that, the ways in our society that we are within those silos, perhaps shouldn't be, and how you would build on that for how you see the ideal Canada or ideal version of your community moving forward?  

[00:57:02] Angele Alook: So, I guess I will just go back to the forest fires in Northern Alberta. So, coming from Northern Alberta and having lived there during some of these forest fires, I started to notice how one summer there was one fire and then another fire, there was a fire in my community at Big Stone and then after that there was fires in Metis settlements that burned down a couple of communities.  

[00:57:34] It felt like we kept taking turns taking care of each other. So, one summer you would, the town of Slave Lake would take care of my community, the next summer my community would take care of that community. When the Fort McMurray fire happened, everybody took care of everybody. But, I do want to say that Indigenous peoples are disproportionately impacted by forest fires. Because of how we fall between federal and provincial jurisdiction, there are some gaps when there is an emergency like this. But there is a sense of community. I can really criticize the provincial and federal governments in how they respond to these fires.  

[00:58:25] Jaela Berstein: When you say gaps, sorry to interrupt, maybe you mean not getting an evacuation notice in time, right?  

[00:58:30] Angele Alook: Yeah, but also like for example in one of the forest fires, we had a busload of elders many with disabilities evacuated without the medications or the people evacuating knowing what illnesses they had. The social worker in my community, my mom, having to figure out how to serve elders with disabilities when they were evacuated. We kind of get -- I think that is the problem with the Indian act and our colonial government, we often with health disparities we fall in-between the cracks.

[00:59:17] In the forest fire that happened in my community and 2019, there was a moment where we were worried that the fire was going to come near my parents house. And then we got a phone call from SCARS, an organization that takes care of animals and rescues animals. They had to go in and rescue our dogs and horses.  

[00:59:47] The way I grew up in my community, it's like five reserve plots around the two lakes. And then Hamlet where the settlers and Metis folks live. So, in that moment we all came together. It just made me realize again how the Indian act has divided us between first Nations and the settlers we have lived with for years that we have community with. So, it really, the forest fires made me really realize the care that I get in my community from everybody there. Still, there were class differences, and race differences, and disability differences in how we were evacuated. In our book, part of that law and principal is that we take care of the most vulnerable when you pull together in times of crisis.  

[01:00:58] Jaela Berstein: I get a sense where there are moments like that where everyone pulled together regardless of their stripes. Maybe you would like to see more of that all the time, not just in those moments.

[01:01:14] Angele Alook: Yeah, and I want to add that have been active in the UNFCCC, where Indigenous folks come from all over the world together to work at that level, we also have great solidarity with certain civil society organizations that support us. For example, when we were in Dubai, there was an action that was organized by a First Nation but also brought together people from, like, Indigenous climate action, environmental network, environmental Defense.  

[01:01:55] We all came together and had, we raise awareness about the environmental destruction of the tar sands industry. It was a protest against tar sands. But also, we, I don't know, we came together in that moment. Raised awareness that polluters need to pay for the damage they are doing to the environment in my territory. That was another example of solidarity that made me feel we are coming together to do something that made me hopeful to be in that action. Yeah.